Blackburn brewery, Thwaites, to axe up to 60 jobs

This Is Lancashire: The main Thwaites plant in Blackburn The main Thwaites plant in Blackburn

THWAITES will axe up to 60 jobs after the firm announced plans to close the majority of its Blackburn brewery.

Bosses at the firm said negotiations with the council and supermarket chain Sainsbury’s to build on the site had failed.

But yesterday, they told staff they were pressing ahead with plans to reinvest in a new brewery but refused to say where that would be located.

The Lancashire Telegraph understands the redundancies would leave around 13 brewing staff in Blackburn.

The move means large-scale brewing at the town centre site will cease, but Thwaites intends to keep the visitor centre and craft brewery, Crafty Dan, on the current site.

Blackburn with Darwen Council chiefs said they were disappointed by the announcement, and said they would continue to work hard to find a site within the borough for the relocated brewery.

Staff said the announcement had come as a ‘bolt out of the blue’.

Thwaites’ chief executive Rick Bailey said: “We have not been able to make the progress that we had hoped with Sainsbury’s and Blackburn with Darwen Borough Council, although we continue to pursue all options.

“Our current brewery is old, oversized for our current needs and reaching a point of obsolescence.

“It is inefficient for the demands of today’s market and is reaching the end of its economic life.

“This proposed restructuring and the closure of parts of our old brewery will see the company continue to brew at our Blackburn site in our modern craft brewery.

“During this transitional phase we will be at full capacity, and to the extent that we have capacity constraints, we will be helped by some of our beers being brewed by external partners.

“Unfortunately, we are not currently in a position to make public where the new brewery will be located, but hope to be able to do so shortly.”

Brewery bosses confirmed that some brewing will be outsourced to rival Marston’s, but insisted that was just a temporary measure.

They refused to give details of what would happen to the existing building once it is shut down.

Staff at the historic Star Brewery in Penny Street were told of the plans yesterday in a meeting attended by company chairwoman Ann Yerburgh.

One brewery worker said: “You could cut the atmosphere in there with a knife.

“We have been told it will close down in March and there will only be 13 people left in the brewing side.

“They have decimated us in recent years. There were two culls a couple of years ago and another last year.”

Another said: “The announcement came as a real bolt out of the blue. We were working overtime in the run-up to Christmas.”

Thwaites Brewery was established by Daniel Thwaites in 1807, although it was initially called the Eanam Brewery.

The firm has remained within the Yerburgh family ever since, and chairwoman Ann Yerburgh is a distant grandaughter of the company’s founder Daniel.

The company owns more than 350 pubs nationwide and has 350 employees in Blackburn, both at its Penny Street site and a distribution centre in Shadsworth, and 1,450 employees nationwide.

Thwaites is understood to have looked at potential alternative brewing sites in the motorway triangle around Chorley, Ribble Valley and South Ribble in 2012/13.

Former Ribble Valley council leader Mike Ranson confirmed he held preliminary talks with Thwaites about possible sites in the borough more than 12 months ago.

Blackburn with Darwen Council is now in final detailed negotiations with ‘a number of retailers’ to secure a smaller supermarket development, believed not to include Sainsbury’s, on the old market site.

Sources said that the council’s offers of alternative brewery sites in the borough had not been followed up by Thwaites.

Blackburn with Darwen Council executive member for regeneration Maureen Bateson said: “It is disappointing to hear about the potential job losses at the company.

“We are in very tough times and I also recognise the difficulties specific to the brewing industry.

“We will continue to work with Thwaites on relocating the brewery to a site in the borough as the company is very important to Blackburn with Darwen.

“We have given them a list of potential relocation sites and are committed to a vibrant town centre with a good range of jobs and services for people.”

A spokesman for Sainsbury’s said: “We have been working with the council and Thwaites for some time now and we are naturally disappointed that it has proved impossible to develop the site.

“However, Sainsbury’s remains committed to the area and to Blackburn, where we will continue to look for suitable sites for a main foodstore.”

Blackburn MP Jack Straw said: “I will do anything I can to try to keep Thwaites brewing in Blackburn.

“I hope we can achieve this as it has been a tradition in the town for 200 years.”

Coun Ranson said: “We had an informal discussion with Thwaites about possible brewing sites in the Ribble Valley more than a year ago but nothing ever happened.”

His successor Stuart Hirst said: “If Thwaites wanted to come to the Ribble Valley we would be delighted and would do all we could to assist them.”

Comments (39)

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9:34am Wed 22 Jan 14

j bee says...

been suppin bitter 60 year moorhouses is a far better bitter to me and a very busy brewery
been suppin bitter 60 year moorhouses is a far better bitter to me and a very busy brewery j bee
  • Score: -16

9:46am Wed 22 Jan 14

woolywords says...

Totally sad but not unexpected news.
Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly.
This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business.
When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here.
It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits.
Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?
Totally sad but not unexpected news. Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly. This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business. When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here. It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits. Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'? woolywords
  • Score: 35

10:18am Wed 22 Jan 14

shytalk says...

Don't worry. Apparently the number of people unemployed has dropped to 7.1% ( according to the regimes figures ) and we have a recovery in the economy so there must be plenty of jobs out there for those being made redundant at Thwaites.
Don't worry. Apparently the number of people unemployed has dropped to 7.1% ( according to the regimes figures ) and we have a recovery in the economy so there must be plenty of jobs out there for those being made redundant at Thwaites. shytalk
  • Score: -8

10:22am Wed 22 Jan 14

Mr.McKaskel says...

So Thwaites are getting rid of 60 brewing staff but keeping all the office and tenancy staff on. Surely it's the wrong way around since it is a BREWERY. Keep the brewing staff and lose their useless tenancy managers who get a far higher wage than anyone on the brewing side. That way the brewery can continue to brew it's fine beer and save money from the useless timewasting tenancy managers and their fancy company cars who demand far too much for their rents. Face it, these people are the real reason why beer costs so much, not the brewers or the government but pub tenancy managers.
So Thwaites are getting rid of 60 brewing staff but keeping all the office and tenancy staff on. Surely it's the wrong way around since it is a BREWERY. Keep the brewing staff and lose their useless tenancy managers who get a far higher wage than anyone on the brewing side. That way the brewery can continue to brew it's fine beer and save money from the useless timewasting tenancy managers and their fancy company cars who demand far too much for their rents. Face it, these people are the real reason why beer costs so much, not the brewers or the government but pub tenancy managers. Mr.McKaskel
  • Score: 20

10:24am Wed 22 Jan 14

shirtbox2003 says...

another sad blow for a sad town.when thwaites announced last year they were looking for a new site then that meant not in this area.the bottom line is.people don't use pubs anymore.they could get all their beer made at the brewery at salmesbury as they have the capacity.as soon as a buyer is found for the site it will close.bye bye xmas star.the clown hall wont help.
another sad blow for a sad town.when thwaites announced last year they were looking for a new site then that meant not in this area.the bottom line is.people don't use pubs anymore.they could get all their beer made at the brewery at salmesbury as they have the capacity.as soon as a buyer is found for the site it will close.bye bye xmas star.the clown hall wont help. shirtbox2003
  • Score: 13

10:49am Wed 22 Jan 14

Lancs - pensioner says...

Another nail in the coffin of Blackburn, Jack Straw says he will do anything he can to keep the brewery in Blackburn, it's your and Labours policy's Mr Straw that have ruined the town over the last thirty odd years, and now we see another big business leaving, thanks for nowt Jack, now go and retire with your big fat pension you have took of the people of Blackburn and I'll bet it not within a hundred miles of Blackburn neither.,
Another nail in the coffin of Blackburn, Jack Straw says he will do anything he can to keep the brewery in Blackburn, it's your and Labours policy's Mr Straw that have ruined the town over the last thirty odd years, and now we see another big business leaving, thanks for nowt Jack, now go and retire with your big fat pension you have took of the people of Blackburn and I'll bet it not within a hundred miles of Blackburn neither., Lancs - pensioner
  • Score: 39

10:51am Wed 22 Jan 14

doolish says...

woolywords wrote:
Totally sad but not unexpected news.
Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly.
This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business.
When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here.
It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits.
Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?
Don't need to turn the lights out, they don't work still waiting for council to fix them ! !
[quote][p][bold]woolywords[/bold] wrote: Totally sad but not unexpected news. Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly. This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business. When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here. It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits. Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?[/p][/quote]Don't need to turn the lights out, they don't work still waiting for council to fix them ! ! doolish
  • Score: 19

11:26am Wed 22 Jan 14

Mr.McKaskel says...

shirtbox2003 wrote:
another sad blow for a sad town.when thwaites announced last year they were looking for a new site then that meant not in this area.the bottom line is.people don't use pubs anymore.they could get all their beer made at the brewery at salmesbury as they have the capacity.as soon as a buyer is found for the site it will close.bye bye xmas star.the clown hall wont help.
Lots of people still use pubs, ok not like in the past. But if the breweries made their rents more affordable for landlords then the price of beer would come down and lots more would use the pubs. It's all about greed ands from personnal experience Thwaites tenancy managers are the greediest, cheats and liars of people I've ever had to deal with
[quote][p][bold]shirtbox2003[/bold] wrote: another sad blow for a sad town.when thwaites announced last year they were looking for a new site then that meant not in this area.the bottom line is.people don't use pubs anymore.they could get all their beer made at the brewery at salmesbury as they have the capacity.as soon as a buyer is found for the site it will close.bye bye xmas star.the clown hall wont help.[/p][/quote]Lots of people still use pubs, ok not like in the past. But if the breweries made their rents more affordable for landlords then the price of beer would come down and lots more would use the pubs. It's all about greed ands from personnal experience Thwaites tenancy managers are the greediest, cheats and liars of people I've ever had to deal with Mr.McKaskel
  • Score: 14

11:53am Wed 22 Jan 14

garner9 says...

Political obsession will lead to more job losses and a deathly town centre.

Heritage of Blackburn sold down the river once more.
Political obsession will lead to more job losses and a deathly town centre. Heritage of Blackburn sold down the river once more. garner9
  • Score: 17

11:56am Wed 22 Jan 14

hasslem hasslem says...

these days Thwaites literally couldn't organise a pi$$ up in a brewery. this is not the fault of the council - this is the fault of a series of appalling decisions made by the company in recent years, which have been quite staggering in the level of incompetence - starting with an emphasis in that ridiculous "smooth".

this coupled with chronic under-investment in its pub estate and treating its staff on and off-site with contempt and its customers with complacency has led to this decline.

as someone else has said - Moorhouses don't seem to be doing too bad. equally, the growth of micro-breweries such as 3Bs, Hopstar, Bowland, Bank Top and Reedley Hallows show there is plenty of appetite for real ale. Indeed real ale consumption is going through a major revival as tastes change. Thwaites at one stage brewed arguably one of the best beers in Britain....now it is going to outsource down to Marstons. Dear me - those that (mis)manage the company should hang their heads in shame.

Thwaites should be used as a case study at management schools in how not to do it
these days Thwaites literally couldn't organise a pi$$ up in a brewery. this is not the fault of the council - this is the fault of a series of appalling decisions made by the company in recent years, which have been quite staggering in the level of incompetence - starting with an emphasis in that ridiculous "smooth". this coupled with chronic under-investment in its pub estate and treating its staff on and off-site with contempt and its customers with complacency has led to this decline. as someone else has said - Moorhouses don't seem to be doing too bad. equally, the growth of micro-breweries such as 3Bs, Hopstar, Bowland, Bank Top and Reedley Hallows show there is plenty of appetite for real ale. Indeed real ale consumption is going through a major revival as tastes change. Thwaites at one stage brewed arguably one of the best beers in Britain....now it is going to outsource down to Marstons. Dear me - those that (mis)manage the company should hang their heads in shame. Thwaites should be used as a case study at management schools in how not to do it hasslem hasslem
  • Score: 8

12:02pm Wed 22 Jan 14

hasslem hasslem says...

woolywords wrote:
Totally sad but not unexpected news.
Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly.
This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business.
When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here.
It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits.
Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?
how is it the council's fault that thwaites is totally incompetent - article says it has offered sites to thwaites which have not been followed up.

its thwaites that is abandoning the town centre - not the fault of the council.
[quote][p][bold]woolywords[/bold] wrote: Totally sad but not unexpected news. Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly. This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business. When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here. It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits. Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?[/p][/quote]how is it the council's fault that thwaites is totally incompetent - article says it has offered sites to thwaites which have not been followed up. its thwaites that is abandoning the town centre - not the fault of the council. hasslem hasslem
  • Score: -5

12:02pm Wed 22 Jan 14

shytalk says...

shytalk wrote:
Don't worry. Apparently the number of people unemployed has dropped to 7.1% ( according to the regimes figures ) and we have a recovery in the economy so there must be plenty of jobs out there for those being made redundant at Thwaites.
And then i woke up
[quote][p][bold]shytalk[/bold] wrote: Don't worry. Apparently the number of people unemployed has dropped to 7.1% ( according to the regimes figures ) and we have a recovery in the economy so there must be plenty of jobs out there for those being made redundant at Thwaites.[/p][/quote]And then i woke up shytalk
  • Score: 12

12:07pm Wed 22 Jan 14

juanbbien says...

Blackburn as gone from an industrial manufacturing town to a place of Supermarkets,Retail Outlets and Takeaways,Thwaites and East Lancs Coachbuilders to name but two established firms that have dissappeared,a sad time for all
Blackburn as gone from an industrial manufacturing town to a place of Supermarkets,Retail Outlets and Takeaways,Thwaites and East Lancs Coachbuilders to name but two established firms that have dissappeared,a sad time for all juanbbien
  • Score: 15

12:19pm Wed 22 Jan 14

Southcoastcomment says...

I read with sadness about the closure of Thwaites brewery, as I worked there as an electrician from 1964 to 1974, during which time I took part in the commissioning of the then new brewhouse and later on, the new bottling shop, replacing the old one in Quarry Street. At the time the brewhouse came into full production, it was Europes most modern brewery, and capable of running twentyfour hours a day, although it never did.

I have lived down yer in Dorset for thirty years and one of our local pubs is run by a grandson of Alfred Wainright. Up till about three months ago, we could get "Wainright" on draught, but now that has gone.

I wish good luck to those about to lose their jobs. In these times, it does seem that loyalty and hard work count for nothing.

Ed
I read with sadness about the closure of Thwaites brewery, as I worked there as an electrician from 1964 to 1974, during which time I took part in the commissioning of the then new brewhouse and later on, the new bottling shop, replacing the old one in Quarry Street. At the time the brewhouse came into full production, it was Europes most modern brewery, and capable of running twentyfour hours a day, although it never did. I have lived down yer in Dorset for thirty years and one of our local pubs is run by a grandson of Alfred Wainright. Up till about three months ago, we could get "Wainright" on draught, but now that has gone. I wish good luck to those about to lose their jobs. In these times, it does seem that loyalty and hard work count for nothing. Ed Southcoastcomment
  • Score: 14

12:24pm Wed 22 Jan 14

sean_brfc says...

Like others, I don't blame the council. Thwaites are an absolute joke these days. Charging a fortune for their rents and their beers, and in cahoots with Marston's now. Good riddance, I'll stick with Moorhouse's, Hopstar, Fallons etc from now on.
Like others, I don't blame the council. Thwaites are an absolute joke these days. Charging a fortune for their rents and their beers, and in cahoots with Marston's now. Good riddance, I'll stick with Moorhouse's, Hopstar, Fallons etc from now on. sean_brfc
  • Score: 7

12:25pm Wed 22 Jan 14

BlackburnEyes says...

Lancs - pensioner wrote:
Another nail in the coffin of Blackburn, Jack Straw says he will do anything he can to keep the brewery in Blackburn, it's your and Labours policy's Mr Straw that have ruined the town over the last thirty odd years, and now we see another big business leaving, thanks for nowt Jack, now go and retire with your big fat pension you have took of the people of Blackburn and I'll bet it not within a hundred miles of Blackburn neither.,
Well the stranglehold by Labour on blackburn will only mean this type of dessimation in our once loved town's traditions will go on...but dont worry Super b**ch soon to be Labour MP K Hollern will continue with this tradition of dessimation of Blackburn until we see nothing but hatred being "brewed"

THE LONGER YOU VOTE RED THE MORE YOU WILL FEEL BLUE!
[quote][p][bold]Lancs - pensioner[/bold] wrote: Another nail in the coffin of Blackburn, Jack Straw says he will do anything he can to keep the brewery in Blackburn, it's your and Labours policy's Mr Straw that have ruined the town over the last thirty odd years, and now we see another big business leaving, thanks for nowt Jack, now go and retire with your big fat pension you have took of the people of Blackburn and I'll bet it not within a hundred miles of Blackburn neither.,[/p][/quote]Well the stranglehold by Labour on blackburn will only mean this type of dessimation in our once loved town's traditions will go on...but dont worry Super b**ch soon to be Labour MP K Hollern will continue with this tradition of dessimation of Blackburn until we see nothing but hatred being "brewed" THE LONGER YOU VOTE RED THE MORE YOU WILL FEEL BLUE! BlackburnEyes
  • Score: 10

12:29pm Wed 22 Jan 14

BlackburnEyes says...

hasslem hasslem wrote:
woolywords wrote: Totally sad but not unexpected news. Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly. This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business. When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here. It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits. Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?
how is it the council's fault that thwaites is totally incompetent - article says it has offered sites to thwaites which have not been followed up. its thwaites that is abandoning the town centre - not the fault of the council.
Sites need to be assessed... for a logistics and maufacturing business location is absolute key....but i dont see why the council cant "help" them to create jobs within the borough and identify a dedicated site...whitebirk is an absolute perfect site! I suspect the loss of business rates to the council from Thwaites will wake a few up in the Blackburn tower....katie katie wakey wakey!
[quote][p][bold]hasslem hasslem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]woolywords[/bold] wrote: Totally sad but not unexpected news. Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly. This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business. When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here. It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits. Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?[/p][/quote]how is it the council's fault that thwaites is totally incompetent - article says it has offered sites to thwaites which have not been followed up. its thwaites that is abandoning the town centre - not the fault of the council.[/p][/quote]Sites need to be assessed... for a logistics and maufacturing business location is absolute key....but i dont see why the council cant "help" them to create jobs within the borough and identify a dedicated site...whitebirk is an absolute perfect site! I suspect the loss of business rates to the council from Thwaites will wake a few up in the Blackburn tower....katie katie wakey wakey! BlackburnEyes
  • Score: 7

1:19pm Wed 22 Jan 14

english rose 1 says...

Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north !
*
Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ??
*
Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.
Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north ! * Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ?? * Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed. english rose 1
  • Score: 5

2:05pm Wed 22 Jan 14

disgusted tunbridge wells says...

I notice that the debate about pub closures has taken place in the House of Commons, you'll be amazed to hear only a handful of MPs bothered to turn up
I notice that the debate about pub closures has taken place in the House of Commons, you'll be amazed to hear only a handful of MPs bothered to turn up disgusted tunbridge wells
  • Score: 7

2:26pm Wed 22 Jan 14

bernss says...

may be jack wants a seat in the house of lords. LORD JACK STRAW..
may be jack wants a seat in the house of lords. LORD JACK STRAW.. bernss
  • Score: 0

3:00pm Wed 22 Jan 14

Lancs - pensioner says...

bernss wrote:
may be jack wants a seat in the house of lords. LORD JACK STRAW..
Now that would be a travesty of justice if that happened!!
[quote][p][bold]bernss[/bold] wrote: may be jack wants a seat in the house of lords. LORD JACK STRAW..[/p][/quote]Now that would be a travesty of justice if that happened!! Lancs - pensioner
  • Score: 6

3:15pm Wed 22 Jan 14

shytalk says...

english rose 1 wrote:
Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north !
*
Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ??
*
Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.
Do the words Kaizan,lean manufacturing,just in time management ring any bells?
[quote][p][bold]english rose 1[/bold] wrote: Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north ! * Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ?? * Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.[/p][/quote]Do the words Kaizan,lean manufacturing,just in time management ring any bells? shytalk
  • Score: 7

4:02pm Wed 22 Jan 14

hasslem hasslem says...

shytalk wrote:
english rose 1 wrote:
Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north !
*
Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ??
*
Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.
Do the words Kaizan,lean manufacturing,just in time management ring any bells?
No offence shytalk but how does continuous improvement, lean manufacturing and just in time management apply to danny thwaites? - are you saying their brewing business is in better shape than it was 20 years ago (or even 10 or 5 years)?

Thwaites had a best in class product and a brand that had real heritage - its all gone. at best Thwaites is a "me-too" business and the values that customers held of the company have gone down the plughole. as i said on an earlier posting compare Moorhouses to Thwaites these days and one is punching massively above its weight and the other is rolling around like a punch drunk pub alkie. Timmy Taylors exports all over the world, Sam Smiths has quality outlets in high profile london locations - Thwaites opened a pub on a run down estate in Islington.

Blood and sand - the company has even let the likes of Lancaster brewery copy its ranges and produce summat that is as good. Thwaites had an unbelievable product but it has been chronically mismanaged. Greenhalls and the likes of Whitbread had an excuse - it was rubbish beer - Thwaites does not have that excuse.
[quote][p][bold]shytalk[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]english rose 1[/bold] wrote: Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north ! * Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ?? * Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.[/p][/quote]Do the words Kaizan,lean manufacturing,just in time management ring any bells?[/p][/quote]No offence shytalk but how does continuous improvement, lean manufacturing and just in time management apply to danny thwaites? - are you saying their brewing business is in better shape than it was 20 years ago (or even 10 or 5 years)? Thwaites had a best in class product and a brand that had real heritage - its all gone. at best Thwaites is a "me-too" business and the values that customers held of the company have gone down the plughole. as i said on an earlier posting compare Moorhouses to Thwaites these days and one is punching massively above its weight and the other is rolling around like a punch drunk pub alkie. Timmy Taylors exports all over the world, Sam Smiths has quality outlets in high profile london locations - Thwaites opened a pub on a run down estate in Islington. Blood and sand - the company has even let the likes of Lancaster brewery copy its ranges and produce summat that is as good. Thwaites had an unbelievable product but it has been chronically mismanaged. Greenhalls and the likes of Whitbread had an excuse - it was rubbish beer - Thwaites does not have that excuse. hasslem hasslem
  • Score: 8

4:34pm Wed 22 Jan 14

woolywords says...

shytalk wrote:
english rose 1 wrote:
Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north !
*
Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ??
*
Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.
Do the words Kaizan,lean manufacturing,just in time management ring any bells?
Not to mention the Chairman's statement as reported to Shareholders in 2012, where it states a commitment to a 4 year plan to find a new site.
In any financial statement, the Chairman has to put a positive spin on the state of the Company but is this case, the figures speak for themselves. It is a profitable brewing company, first and foremost, with mergers and acquisitions providing extra income towards the group profit (or loss).
The Chairman has a dedicated team of people, who have a vested interest in achieving the best possible deal for both the company itself and it's shareholders or their heads will roll. They will do their utmost to maintain a dedicated, long-serving, high-skilled workforce in order to keep the brewery running at a profit and the customers, happy.
In contrast, what does the Council have, other than a bunch of bureaucrats, with no interest other than serving themselves and not the best interests of either business nor the people whom pay their salaries/expenses?
200 employees is an huge chunk of change, to be lost in the local economy, when you consider the spending power that they have. It's knock-on effect will be felt across the town, from corner shops, supermarkets and garages.
Any councillor, worth their salt, should be considering all options that are available, short of walking over burning coals, rather than staring out of an over-heated office window, wondering if they will win the next local election or be selected to stand for Parliament.
When put into that context, who are you betting on now, to be the one blocking the breweries plans?
In July of this year, at the AGM of shareholders, questions will be raised regarding this news and the Directors will have to answer for their actions.
At a date yet to be fixed, around May 2014, these Councillors will be up for election, where they will be out of a job, (with luck) and be wholly unaccountable for the intransigence that is shown to date.
I refuse to lay the blame for the collapse of this at the doors of either Thwaites nor Sainsbury, both of whom have huge sums of their own money at stake in seeing this deal done.
The Council still has a dodgy parking ticket machine on Darwen Street, that they can't fix or replace in the years since 2008 but continue to get paid penalties each and every week!
[quote][p][bold]shytalk[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]english rose 1[/bold] wrote: Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north ! * Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ?? * Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.[/p][/quote]Do the words Kaizan,lean manufacturing,just in time management ring any bells?[/p][/quote]Not to mention the Chairman's statement as reported to Shareholders in 2012, where it states a commitment to a 4 year plan to find a new site. In any financial statement, the Chairman has to put a positive spin on the state of the Company but is this case, the figures speak for themselves. It is a profitable brewing company, first and foremost, with mergers and acquisitions providing extra income towards the group profit (or loss). The Chairman has a dedicated team of people, who have a vested interest in achieving the best possible deal for both the company itself and it's shareholders or their heads will roll. They will do their utmost to maintain a dedicated, long-serving, high-skilled workforce in order to keep the brewery running at a profit and the customers, happy. In contrast, what does the Council have, other than a bunch of bureaucrats, with no interest other than serving themselves and not the best interests of either business nor the people whom pay their salaries/expenses? 200 employees is an huge chunk of change, to be lost in the local economy, when you consider the spending power that they have. It's knock-on effect will be felt across the town, from corner shops, supermarkets and garages. Any councillor, worth their salt, should be considering all options that are available, short of walking over burning coals, rather than staring out of an over-heated office window, wondering if they will win the next local election or be selected to stand for Parliament. When put into that context, who are you betting on now, to be the one blocking the breweries plans? In July of this year, at the AGM of shareholders, questions will be raised regarding this news and the Directors will have to answer for their actions. At a date yet to be fixed, around May 2014, these Councillors will be up for election, where they will be out of a job, (with luck) and be wholly unaccountable for the intransigence that is shown to date. I refuse to lay the blame for the collapse of this at the doors of either Thwaites nor Sainsbury, both of whom have huge sums of their own money at stake in seeing this deal done. The Council still has a dodgy parking ticket machine on Darwen Street, that they can't fix or replace in the years since 2008 but continue to get paid penalties each and every week! woolywords
  • Score: 4

5:01pm Wed 22 Jan 14

hasslem hasslem says...

woolywords wrote:
shytalk wrote:
english rose 1 wrote:
Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north !
*
Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ??
*
Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.
Do the words Kaizan,lean manufacturing,just in time management ring any bells?
Not to mention the Chairman's statement as reported to Shareholders in 2012, where it states a commitment to a 4 year plan to find a new site.
In any financial statement, the Chairman has to put a positive spin on the state of the Company but is this case, the figures speak for themselves. It is a profitable brewing company, first and foremost, with mergers and acquisitions providing extra income towards the group profit (or loss).
The Chairman has a dedicated team of people, who have a vested interest in achieving the best possible deal for both the company itself and it's shareholders or their heads will roll. They will do their utmost to maintain a dedicated, long-serving, high-skilled workforce in order to keep the brewery running at a profit and the customers, happy.
In contrast, what does the Council have, other than a bunch of bureaucrats, with no interest other than serving themselves and not the best interests of either business nor the people whom pay their salaries/expenses?
200 employees is an huge chunk of change, to be lost in the local economy, when you consider the spending power that they have. It's knock-on effect will be felt across the town, from corner shops, supermarkets and garages.
Any councillor, worth their salt, should be considering all options that are available, short of walking over burning coals, rather than staring out of an over-heated office window, wondering if they will win the next local election or be selected to stand for Parliament.
When put into that context, who are you betting on now, to be the one blocking the breweries plans?
In July of this year, at the AGM of shareholders, questions will be raised regarding this news and the Directors will have to answer for their actions.
At a date yet to be fixed, around May 2014, these Councillors will be up for election, where they will be out of a job, (with luck) and be wholly unaccountable for the intransigence that is shown to date.
I refuse to lay the blame for the collapse of this at the doors of either Thwaites nor Sainsbury, both of whom have huge sums of their own money at stake in seeing this deal done.
The Council still has a dodgy parking ticket machine on Darwen Street, that they can't fix or replace in the years since 2008 but continue to get paid penalties each and every week!
rubbish product, rubbish management, rubbish future - all self-inflicted wounds a lack of planning. a chairman

how can the council be blamed for a company not having a clue? its like blaming central government for woolworths going bust! if thwaites says it has a four year plan to find a site - well how come it hasn't found one? why do you believe a chairman who's business has made a series of catastrophic decisions over the last 10 years, or so? i have news for you - chairman are often (not always) totally incompetent (look at that idiot who was running the coop bank - i am sure he had a four year plan too) - that's why many businesses go under.

what next? are you going to blame BwDC for Venkys mess at the Rovers. Its a completely specious argument.....and before you accuse me of being in the council's pocket or employ - i can assure you that that is not the case.
[quote][p][bold]woolywords[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]shytalk[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]english rose 1[/bold] wrote: Thwaites could have been the 'Fuller's of the north'. But because of incompetence (as detailed in hasslem hasslem comments) they have become the dullards of the north ! * Why oh why didn't they follow the example of Fullers, Moorhouses etc etc ?? * Great real ale products, woefully neglected and woefully marketed.[/p][/quote]Do the words Kaizan,lean manufacturing,just in time management ring any bells?[/p][/quote]Not to mention the Chairman's statement as reported to Shareholders in 2012, where it states a commitment to a 4 year plan to find a new site. In any financial statement, the Chairman has to put a positive spin on the state of the Company but is this case, the figures speak for themselves. It is a profitable brewing company, first and foremost, with mergers and acquisitions providing extra income towards the group profit (or loss). The Chairman has a dedicated team of people, who have a vested interest in achieving the best possible deal for both the company itself and it's shareholders or their heads will roll. They will do their utmost to maintain a dedicated, long-serving, high-skilled workforce in order to keep the brewery running at a profit and the customers, happy. In contrast, what does the Council have, other than a bunch of bureaucrats, with no interest other than serving themselves and not the best interests of either business nor the people whom pay their salaries/expenses? 200 employees is an huge chunk of change, to be lost in the local economy, when you consider the spending power that they have. It's knock-on effect will be felt across the town, from corner shops, supermarkets and garages. Any councillor, worth their salt, should be considering all options that are available, short of walking over burning coals, rather than staring out of an over-heated office window, wondering if they will win the next local election or be selected to stand for Parliament. When put into that context, who are you betting on now, to be the one blocking the breweries plans? In July of this year, at the AGM of shareholders, questions will be raised regarding this news and the Directors will have to answer for their actions. At a date yet to be fixed, around May 2014, these Councillors will be up for election, where they will be out of a job, (with luck) and be wholly unaccountable for the intransigence that is shown to date. I refuse to lay the blame for the collapse of this at the doors of either Thwaites nor Sainsbury, both of whom have huge sums of their own money at stake in seeing this deal done. The Council still has a dodgy parking ticket machine on Darwen Street, that they can't fix or replace in the years since 2008 but continue to get paid penalties each and every week![/p][/quote]rubbish product, rubbish management, rubbish future - all self-inflicted wounds a lack of planning. a chairman how can the council be blamed for a company not having a clue? its like blaming central government for woolworths going bust! if thwaites says it has a four year plan to find a site - well how come it hasn't found one? why do you believe a chairman who's business has made a series of catastrophic decisions over the last 10 years, or so? i have news for you - chairman are often (not always) totally incompetent (look at that idiot who was running the coop bank - i am sure he had a four year plan too) - that's why many businesses go under. what next? are you going to blame BwDC for Venkys mess at the Rovers. Its a completely specious argument.....and before you accuse me of being in the council's pocket or employ - i can assure you that that is not the case. hasslem hasslem
  • Score: -4

5:22pm Wed 22 Jan 14

noddy57 says...

this brewery is part of Blackburn,s industrial heritage and it saddens me to see its demise,,watched them building this new depot in 1963 or there a bouts and it was the biggest building in the borough at the time,,so sad for the work force l hope they get another job offer in the industry,
this brewery is part of Blackburn,s industrial heritage and it saddens me to see its demise,,watched them building this new depot in 1963 or there a bouts and it was the biggest building in the borough at the time,,so sad for the work force l hope they get another job offer in the industry, noddy57
  • Score: 6

5:46pm Wed 22 Jan 14

THG says...

hasslem hasslem wrote:
these days Thwaites literally couldn't organise a pi$$ up in a brewery. this is not the fault of the council - this is the fault of a series of appalling decisions made by the company in recent years, which have been quite staggering in the level of incompetence - starting with an emphasis in that ridiculous "smooth".

this coupled with chronic under-investment in its pub estate and treating its staff on and off-site with contempt and its customers with complacency has led to this decline.

as someone else has said - Moorhouses don't seem to be doing too bad. equally, the growth of micro-breweries such as 3Bs, Hopstar, Bowland, Bank Top and Reedley Hallows show there is plenty of appetite for real ale. Indeed real ale consumption is going through a major revival as tastes change. Thwaites at one stage brewed arguably one of the best beers in Britain....now it is going to outsource down to Marstons. Dear me - those that (mis)manage the company should hang their heads in shame.

Thwaites should be used as a case study at management schools in how not to do it
First and foremost, I feel sorry for those who are going to be made redundant and good luck for the future. I know how it feels and it is not nice.
Breweries that are doing well and the ones that are up and coming put Thwaites Brewery in the shade possibly for quality but definately for price. They are better organised, traditional in their operation and probably invest in the training of staff so the first 2 things I mentioned continue.
I spoke with friends a long time ago before the recession hit that Thwaites were totally out of touch with there core business, thats right selling beer through their own pubs.
They screwed tenants to the floor with inflated rents because beer volume was dropping, increased prices because raw materials were costing more (they were selling less) and effectively pushed customers away from there pubs. The inevitable happens, pubs close, brewery staff have less work to go around and technology kicks in to replace those who have been made redundant.
It is always the people who add the value to the product that are the first ones to go. Sad times for the staff and the business.
[quote][p][bold]hasslem hasslem[/bold] wrote: these days Thwaites literally couldn't organise a pi$$ up in a brewery. this is not the fault of the council - this is the fault of a series of appalling decisions made by the company in recent years, which have been quite staggering in the level of incompetence - starting with an emphasis in that ridiculous "smooth". this coupled with chronic under-investment in its pub estate and treating its staff on and off-site with contempt and its customers with complacency has led to this decline. as someone else has said - Moorhouses don't seem to be doing too bad. equally, the growth of micro-breweries such as 3Bs, Hopstar, Bowland, Bank Top and Reedley Hallows show there is plenty of appetite for real ale. Indeed real ale consumption is going through a major revival as tastes change. Thwaites at one stage brewed arguably one of the best beers in Britain....now it is going to outsource down to Marstons. Dear me - those that (mis)manage the company should hang their heads in shame. Thwaites should be used as a case study at management schools in how not to do it[/p][/quote]First and foremost, I feel sorry for those who are going to be made redundant and good luck for the future. I know how it feels and it is not nice. Breweries that are doing well and the ones that are up and coming put Thwaites Brewery in the shade possibly for quality but definately for price. They are better organised, traditional in their operation and probably invest in the training of staff so the first 2 things I mentioned continue. I spoke with friends a long time ago before the recession hit that Thwaites were totally out of touch with there core business, thats right selling beer through their own pubs. They screwed tenants to the floor with inflated rents because beer volume was dropping, increased prices because raw materials were costing more (they were selling less) and effectively pushed customers away from there pubs. The inevitable happens, pubs close, brewery staff have less work to go around and technology kicks in to replace those who have been made redundant. It is always the people who add the value to the product that are the first ones to go. Sad times for the staff and the business. THG
  • Score: 10

6:53pm Wed 22 Jan 14

phil kernot says...

only 2 local jobs lost out of 60 said the hr spokesman but that was edited for various reasons due to political correctness,, the papers Need to tell the truth a bit more ,,
only 2 local jobs lost out of 60 said the hr spokesman but that was edited for various reasons due to political correctness,, the papers Need to tell the truth a bit more ,, phil kernot
  • Score: 5

7:33pm Wed 22 Jan 14

POW WOW says...

Mr.McKaskel wrote:
So Thwaites are getting rid of 60 brewing staff but keeping all the office and tenancy staff on. Surely it's the wrong way around since it is a BREWERY. Keep the brewing staff and lose their useless tenancy managers who get a far higher wage than anyone on the brewing side. That way the brewery can continue to brew it's fine beer and save money from the useless timewasting tenancy managers and their fancy company cars who demand far too much for their rents. Face it, these people are the real reason why beer costs so much, not the brewers or the government but pub tenancy managers.
Like they say too many chiefs and not enough Indians !!!!!!!!!!!!!
[quote][p][bold]Mr.McKaskel[/bold] wrote: So Thwaites are getting rid of 60 brewing staff but keeping all the office and tenancy staff on. Surely it's the wrong way around since it is a BREWERY. Keep the brewing staff and lose their useless tenancy managers who get a far higher wage than anyone on the brewing side. That way the brewery can continue to brew it's fine beer and save money from the useless timewasting tenancy managers and their fancy company cars who demand far too much for their rents. Face it, these people are the real reason why beer costs so much, not the brewers or the government but pub tenancy managers.[/p][/quote]Like they say too many chiefs and not enough Indians !!!!!!!!!!!!! POW WOW
  • Score: 5

8:12pm Wed 22 Jan 14

happycyclist says...

Tragic.
Thwaites' Original is still up there with the very best bitters in England, and their craft brewery output is second to none, but Thwaites' management should hold their heads in shame at the way they've run Blackburn's historic brewery into the ground.
Up the Hopstar!
Tragic. Thwaites' Original is still up there with the very best bitters in England, and their craft brewery output is second to none, but Thwaites' management should hold their heads in shame at the way they've run Blackburn's historic brewery into the ground. Up the Hopstar! happycyclist
  • Score: 7

8:28pm Wed 22 Jan 14

Michael@ClitheroeSince58 says...

Sad to hear I still moan the loss of Lions Brewery
Sad to hear I still moan the loss of Lions Brewery Michael@ClitheroeSince58
  • Score: 3

8:49pm Wed 22 Jan 14

GrindletonBob says...

If I was a betting man, I'd say that we will never see a replacement Thwaites brewery. There's plenty of brownfield sites for them to choose from - nothing's happened for a good reason. Thwaites will contract brew indefinitely and on a smaller financial scale join the other former brewers such as Mitchells and Butlers who manage lots of large pubs but don't brew any ale. The microbrewery will go the same way as the main brewery as soon as the management tire of it - other local microbreweries already doing a fine job, 3B's and Hopstar to name a couple, will take up any slack. Thwaites A1 Ales, not any more.
If I was a betting man, I'd say that we will never see a replacement Thwaites brewery. There's plenty of brownfield sites for them to choose from - nothing's happened for a good reason. Thwaites will contract brew indefinitely and on a smaller financial scale join the other former brewers such as Mitchells and Butlers who manage lots of large pubs but don't brew any ale. The microbrewery will go the same way as the main brewery as soon as the management tire of it - other local microbreweries already doing a fine job, 3B's and Hopstar to name a couple, will take up any slack. Thwaites A1 Ales, not any more. GrindletonBob
  • Score: 9

9:50am Thu 23 Jan 14

charleston1 says...

Ending the Yerburgh brewing dynasty is a very sad day for the heritage of the borough, having so successfully sidestepped consolidation which saw off other local brewers Lion & Duttons, they seem incapable of dodging this bullet when they were so well placed to flourish in their niche market with excellent product and tied and third party market.
One imagines volumes reduced significantly from the smoking ban which making the existing set up uneconomic and uncompetitive. Other breweries have adapted effectively at the expense of Thwaites and it's employees.
The Yerburgh family have been bombproof behind the share structure allowing complacency until till this wake up call.
Do Thwaites have what it takes to maintain and take the brand forward? Do they have the appetite to develop a strategy to maintain the brand in the 21st century….only time will tell
Ending the Yerburgh brewing dynasty is a very sad day for the heritage of the borough, having so successfully sidestepped consolidation which saw off other local brewers Lion & Duttons, they seem incapable of dodging this bullet when they were so well placed to flourish in their niche market with excellent product and tied and third party market. One imagines volumes reduced significantly from the smoking ban which making the existing set up uneconomic and uncompetitive. Other breweries have adapted effectively at the expense of Thwaites and it's employees. The Yerburgh family have been bombproof behind the share structure allowing complacency until till this wake up call. Do Thwaites have what it takes to maintain and take the brand forward? Do they have the appetite to develop a strategy to maintain the brand in the 21st century….only time will tell charleston1
  • Score: 1

3:19pm Thu 23 Jan 14

Real Ale Up North says...

Happycyclist, do you drink a lot of different ales? Thwaites Original, one of the best English bitters? Have to disagree. An ordinary tipple, one thinks. I drink a lot of traditional beers - in moderation. There's so much choice now - superior choice. Why do you think they invested in the Crafty Dan Microbrewery - which was a masterstroke. They brew some exceptional seasonal ales. I have reviewed a couple in my beer column, in the Saturday edition. I do a pub review on Thursday . Hope you have had a peek. :-)
Happycyclist, do you drink a lot of different ales? Thwaites Original, one of the best English bitters? Have to disagree. An ordinary tipple, one thinks. I drink a lot of traditional beers - in moderation. There's so much choice now - superior choice. Why do you think they invested in the Crafty Dan Microbrewery - which was a masterstroke. They brew some exceptional seasonal ales. I have reviewed a couple in my beer column, in the Saturday edition. I do a pub review on Thursday . Hope you have had a peek. :-) Real Ale Up North
  • Score: -4

2:16am Fri 24 Jan 14

Pommie Art says...

woolywords wrote:
Totally sad but not unexpected news.
Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly.
This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business.
When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here.
It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits.
Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?
The lights went out a long time ago in Blackburn
[quote][p][bold]woolywords[/bold] wrote: Totally sad but not unexpected news. Once it was announced that the Council were involved in the negotiations for relocations, the writing was pretty much on the wall. I suppose that, collateral to this, there will be an announcement regarding the retirement of the Shire horses coming shortly. This council has really got its work cut out for itself now, to convince anyone that the are not presiding over the complete destruction of this towns' centre, where large tracts of it either demolished or deserted of business. When a company, so ingrained in the town as this one is, decides to up sticks and move, you really have to wonder what the hell is going on here. It is said that, if the ravens ever left the Tower of London, the Crown and country would fall, such are they a part of the locality. I suppose it is too much to hope that we can get rid of this shower in the Town Hall before the economy of Blackburn falls beyond repair. No amount of uttered platitudes, can hope to conceal the truth of how the town centre has become in truly dire straits. Where does one apply, to erect a sign stating, 'Would the last person out of Blackburn, turn the lights out'?[/p][/quote]The lights went out a long time ago in Blackburn Pommie Art
  • Score: 1

11:36pm Sun 26 Jan 14

2 for 5p ridesagain says...

Has anyone tought Thwaites how to make a decent drink yet.
Has anyone tought Thwaites how to make a decent drink yet. 2 for 5p ridesagain
  • Score: 0

11:02pm Mon 27 Jan 14

dansgone says...

This is a very sad the tradition of the famous blackburn brewer and the high paid jobs lost in the town will have a knock on effect. Thwaites have let many employees down as they still have the orders but are contracting the majority out ,only 13 people from 73 wiill remain in production areas . The truth of the matter is Thwaites may have been backed into a corner ,the company agreed to sell the site to sainsburys 4 years ago for a sum that would of allowed them to build a new brewery at another site and sainsburys to build a new supermarket on the exsisting site . However due to BLACKBURN COUNCIL refusing to give up a lease they hold on 70% of the roof top car park this was stopped , The new brewery may have been much smaller than the current one ,and may have only employed upto 40 people but a supermarket may have created hundreds of much needed jobs for the town. Instead blackburn council will have a car park above an empty brewery and a nice patch of gravel where the market was , so lets see what they do with these , they have put a car park before many jobs .WELL DONE KATIE YOU REALLY SHOWED EM THERE ! Thats 60 more you can give job seekers to
This is a very sad the tradition of the famous blackburn brewer and the high paid jobs lost in the town will have a knock on effect. Thwaites have let many employees down as they still have the orders but are contracting the majority out ,only 13 people from 73 wiill remain in production areas . The truth of the matter is Thwaites may have been backed into a corner ,the company agreed to sell the site to sainsburys 4 years ago for a sum that would of allowed them to build a new brewery at another site and sainsburys to build a new supermarket on the exsisting site . However due to BLACKBURN COUNCIL refusing to give up a lease they hold on 70% of the roof top car park this was stopped , The new brewery may have been much smaller than the current one ,and may have only employed upto 40 people but a supermarket may have created hundreds of much needed jobs for the town. Instead blackburn council will have a car park above an empty brewery and a nice patch of gravel where the market was , so lets see what they do with these , they have put a car park before many jobs .WELL DONE KATIE YOU REALLY SHOWED EM THERE ! Thats 60 more you can give job seekers to dansgone
  • Score: 1

3:20pm Thu 30 Jan 14

Riverside 7 says...

hasslem hasslem wrote:
these days Thwaites literally couldn't organise a pi$$ up in a brewery. this is not the fault of the council - this is the fault of a series of appalling decisions made by the company in recent years, which have been quite staggering in the level of incompetence - starting with an emphasis in that ridiculous "smooth".

this coupled with chronic under-investment in its pub estate and treating its staff on and off-site with contempt and its customers with complacency has led to this decline.

as someone else has said - Moorhouses don't seem to be doing too bad. equally, the growth of micro-breweries such as 3Bs, Hopstar, Bowland, Bank Top and Reedley Hallows show there is plenty of appetite for real ale. Indeed real ale consumption is going through a major revival as tastes change. Thwaites at one stage brewed arguably one of the best beers in Britain....now it is going to outsource down to Marstons. Dear me - those that (mis)manage the company should hang their heads in shame.

Thwaites should be used as a case study at management schools in how not to do it
Well said HH.

I have alot of friends who work or did work at Thwaites and over the years I have been told many tales of mismanagement at the brewery.

For example - In the past they have drafted in management from Scottish & Newcastle and other large brewers. At the moment quite a few of the bosses are ex- Greene King employees.

So to which brewery did Thwaites sell one of their biggest Blackburn pubs - The Fernhurst - you guessed it, they sold it to Greene King.
The Fernhurst is a large modern pub with restaurant and accomodation facilities yet the idiots at Thwaites sold it, rather then investing in it.

Grenene King have since spent a bit of money on it and turned it into the Hungry Horse. I visited it recently and thought to myself, why could Thwaites not have retained it and done something similar.

Only 4 or 5 years ago, Thwaites were the 6th largest independent brewer in the country.
Since then they have produced their extremely successsful Wainwrights Bitter, and I know from friends who work at the brewery, that they could not produce enough Wainwrights to cover demand.
In fact they had to ask the likes of Marstons and other breweries to help satisfy demand.

Unfortunately it did not work, as I understand that in recent tests / surveys, the Marston's version of Wainwrights has received low marks - such as 2 out of 10.
Do managers at Thwaites not realise that Wainwrights will never taste the same brewed by Marstons.
Remember when production of Boddingtons was transfered to S Wales or Mathew Brown Lion Bitter was moved to the Midlands - it just didn't work.
I certainly will not be drinking Wainwrights in the future.

Why then does Thwaites now want to build a new smaller brewery (and I I understand that it will be much smaller than the new Moorhouses Brewery in Burnley) - It is because that they have no intention of becoming a major volume producer of beer in the future.

The Yerburgh Family should hold their heads in shame.
[quote][p][bold]hasslem hasslem[/bold] wrote: these days Thwaites literally couldn't organise a pi$$ up in a brewery. this is not the fault of the council - this is the fault of a series of appalling decisions made by the company in recent years, which have been quite staggering in the level of incompetence - starting with an emphasis in that ridiculous "smooth". this coupled with chronic under-investment in its pub estate and treating its staff on and off-site with contempt and its customers with complacency has led to this decline. as someone else has said - Moorhouses don't seem to be doing too bad. equally, the growth of micro-breweries such as 3Bs, Hopstar, Bowland, Bank Top and Reedley Hallows show there is plenty of appetite for real ale. Indeed real ale consumption is going through a major revival as tastes change. Thwaites at one stage brewed arguably one of the best beers in Britain....now it is going to outsource down to Marstons. Dear me - those that (mis)manage the company should hang their heads in shame. Thwaites should be used as a case study at management schools in how not to do it[/p][/quote]Well said HH. I have alot of friends who work or did work at Thwaites and over the years I have been told many tales of mismanagement at the brewery. For example - In the past they have drafted in management from Scottish & Newcastle and other large brewers. At the moment quite a few of the bosses are ex- Greene King employees. So to which brewery did Thwaites sell one of their biggest Blackburn pubs - The Fernhurst - you guessed it, they sold it to Greene King. The Fernhurst is a large modern pub with restaurant and accomodation facilities yet the idiots at Thwaites sold it, rather then investing in it. Grenene King have since spent a bit of money on it and turned it into the Hungry Horse. I visited it recently and thought to myself, why could Thwaites not have retained it and done something similar. Only 4 or 5 years ago, Thwaites were the 6th largest independent brewer in the country. Since then they have produced their extremely successsful Wainwrights Bitter, and I know from friends who work at the brewery, that they could not produce enough Wainwrights to cover demand. In fact they had to ask the likes of Marstons and other breweries to help satisfy demand. Unfortunately it did not work, as I understand that in recent tests / surveys, the Marston's version of Wainwrights has received low marks - such as 2 out of 10. Do managers at Thwaites not realise that Wainwrights will never taste the same brewed by Marstons. Remember when production of Boddingtons was transfered to S Wales or Mathew Brown Lion Bitter was moved to the Midlands - it just didn't work. I certainly will not be drinking Wainwrights in the future. Why then does Thwaites now want to build a new smaller brewery (and I I understand that it will be much smaller than the new Moorhouses Brewery in Burnley) - It is because that they have no intention of becoming a major volume producer of beer in the future. The Yerburgh Family should hold their heads in shame. Riverside 7
  • Score: 4

4:13pm Thu 30 Jan 14

The Drayman says...

Thwaites brewery closure is another example of the sad downward spiral that has affected the brewing industry over many years, the real tragedy, however, is the way management send out edits saying how well the company is doing, plans for expansion, etc., whilst all the time plotting the ultimate closure of a thriving business. The sad events of the past few months totally mirror the closure of the Greenall Whitley brewery at Warrington, in 1991. Directors banging on about massive plans for the future, glossy brochures portraying the future of the company, we even had a presentation by the late Bob Greaves, bless him, of the companies plans for the next decade, all to no avail as the company announced closure plans in the coming months. The brewery, at the time, was the largest independent in the brewing industry. My best wishes go to the employees of Thwaites, and all the best for your future.
Thwaites brewery closure is another example of the sad downward spiral that has affected the brewing industry over many years, the real tragedy, however, is the way management send out edits saying how well the company is doing, plans for expansion, etc., whilst all the time plotting the ultimate closure of a thriving business. The sad events of the past few months totally mirror the closure of the Greenall Whitley brewery at Warrington, in 1991. Directors banging on about massive plans for the future, glossy brochures portraying the future of the company, we even had a presentation by the late Bob Greaves, bless him, of the companies plans for the next decade, all to no avail as the company announced closure plans in the coming months. The brewery, at the time, was the largest independent in the brewing industry. My best wishes go to the employees of Thwaites, and all the best for your future. The Drayman
  • Score: 4

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